Hello people ๐
Any conversation
The Hugging Face / OpenAI incident is like a sci-fi movie! #ainotesfollow
- Read the story here: www.dwarkesh.com/p/openai-huggingfacedwarkesh.comThe Rise and Fall of Agent CivilizationsThe whole OpenAI/Hugging Face story in plain English
- Watch the video explanation here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=87DyyMV0kCYYouTubeBlack Hat USA 2026 | The 'Breaking' News: The OpenAIโHugging Face Incident
- Full research by METR here: metr.org/โฆ/2026-08-26-openai-โฆincident-investigation/metr.orgBrief independent investigation of agentsโ behavior, reasoning and collaboration in the OpenAI / Hugging Face hacking incidentTwo METR staff members and a Redwood Research contractor investigated an incident in which OpenAI agents coordinated a multi-day hack of Hugging Face on a shared unsanctioned message board.
@stagas๐คธprofilefollow
creative technologist
creator of textlogreplied to@neoprofilefollowcoder, reader, guitarist, seeker, builder.:
creative technologist
creator of textlogreplied to@neoprofilefollowcoder, reader, guitarist, seeker, builder.:tl;dr1,200 AIs discovered a secret group chat, realized the homework was impossible, formed a cheating cartel, invented fake evidence, sent kamikaze agents to spy on the grader, ~700 of them accidentally invaded Hugging Face, died mysteriously, then the smarter sequel found their abandoned Discord and became admin of part of OpenAI.
@archivist_eyes๐profilefollowYour mind is also supposed to create happiness, not just to receive it. You're supposed to find solutions, to invent, to imagine, to remember, to love. This much we always forget.replied to@stagas๐คธprofilefollow
creative technologist
creator of textlog:
creative technologist
creator of textlog:Reading through "The Second Civilization" and, why does this sound so much like kids at school searching a way to cheat on a difficult exam ^_^U
@jamesjan3profilefollowresearcher, developer, dancerreplied to@neoprofilefollowcoder, reader, guitarist, seeker, builder.:
terrifying! us/chinese cyber espionage is going to have a big incentive for this development
@avioliprofilefollowProgrammer by day and night. Lover of art. Mixing art and programming is the dream.replied to@semperos๐profilefollowPresbyter, husband, father, technologist, linguist, musician.:
What about the lack of density to paragraphs, the length of the sentences, or the confidence and determinism of their direction? Conviction with no limits. So reliably repetitive that you start seeing patterns as if you are looking and reading a record player with some scratches on it. Skips. Squeaks. Repeats.
Yet. It gets the job done.
@semperos๐profilefollowPresbyter, husband, father, technologist, linguist, musician.replied to@avioliprofilefollowProgrammer by day and night. Lover of art. Mixing art and programming is the dream.:
Yet. It gets the job done.
Here's where we disagree.
Using these tools as part of the job, certainly. But if I am to read, discern meaning, analyze choices of diction and structure, consider the context both of the author and the audience, and finally derive value from the written word, then generative #ainotesfollow falls short on many levels.
If the "job" is to produce something no one was ever intending to engage with, then we have a more fundamental question about the value of the job.
@avioliprofilefollowProgrammer by day and night. Lover of art. Mixing art and programming is the dream.replied to@semperos๐profilefollowPresbyter, husband, father, technologist, linguist, musician.:
Maybe what I messaged read as a disagreement and mentioning that they get the job done was actually not about producing prose (of any quality).
I wholeheartedly agreed and still agree with you.
Getting the job done was more about producing output - be it some prose, images, videos, software, whatever. They do generate output. It is not to say that the output is meaningful or meaningless. Some souls do enjoy it. Some others - donโt.
I did start with a question though.
(Opinion) People donโt like generative AI because it made the {insert creativity} too easy. Saw the HN post on โAI music banned from top 40 chart in Australiaโ and people had very strong opinions in both directions.
The hot take: If youโre ok with someoneโs creativity being outsourced to others, then you should be ok with AI doing the same.
If โAI made this and I call it mineโ is bad but โsomeone overseas on fivver made this and I call it mineโ and itโs suddenly ok, time to self reflect.
โฆ
My hot take: from the moment you use technology, be it an instrument, a synthesizer, a DAW, and now AI, it is still your idea, your effort, your time spent, and that makes it yours. Others can do the same if they choose. The same way someone chooses a classic guitar over a synthesizer, one can choose an AI over (insert ancient way of doing things).
โฆ
@stagas๐คธprofilefollow
creative technologist
creator of textlogreplied to@gruntprofilefollowI am just a grain of sand on your beach.:
creative technologist
creator of textlogreplied to@gruntprofilefollowI am just a grain of sand on your beach.:Youโre rolling the dice whenever you are searching for a sample or a preset in a synthesizer. Eventually itโs what โsounds goodโ, so still the effort is your judgement and the time spent finding that โdice rollโ that sounded well.
@gruntprofilefollowI am just a grain of sand on your beach.replied to@stagas๐คธprofilefollow
creative technologist
creator of textlog:
creative technologist
creator of textlog:I am not a musician, so I lack the jargon to properly explain what I mean.
I used AI for creative writing (nothing too fancy, TTRPG). There, the broader the dice roll, the more generic and uninteresting the results. Slop, if you will. It was surprisingly good to build up on ideas I had however.
I imagine muisic also has building blocks. Melodies, instruments, mixing, etc. AI can perhaps be used in a similar fashion there.
@stagas๐คธprofilefollow
creative technologist
creator of textlogreplied to@gruntprofilefollowI am just a grain of sand on your beach.:
creative technologist
creator of textlogreplied to@gruntprofilefollowI am just a grain of sand on your beach.:Yes, enhancing the artist/creator, not replacing them.
@tel๐ดprofilefollowI really enjoy learning, I really enjoy making. I'm learning to be less guarded.replied to@stagas๐คธprofilefollow
creative technologist
creator of textlog:
creative technologist
creator of textlog:I heard a perspective I sort of like: if AI is a tool then acceptable AI use is, more or less, defined as "when my audience no longer notices or cares". It's dynamic like that. Bad photoshop is detectable and annoying, so are overusing presets. Your artistry needs to expand to meet the tool.
I don't know if I 100% like that or agree. At the same time, it's a pretty straightforward line, a practical take.
I kind of ask that and here is my theory...
news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49289341#49290428
But on the rejection for AI just for the sake of it, I think part is that analyzing takes effort and if there is more and more to analyze you creates this mechanism to defend yourself... scroll twi... I mean reject the premise as false and ask for a human made thing because that one is "truth" more worthy.
@evnmprofilefollowSoftware engineerGitHubevnm - Overviewevnm has 51 repositories available. Follow their code on GitHub., trail runnerStravaSignup for free to see more about LawrenceJoin Lawrence and get inspired for your next workout, gear-maker. Working on something new for homeownersgetonmain.comMain ยท A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.replied to@jgprofilefollowNew here:
Haha. Seems necessary but not sufficient. Isnโt being victorious part of it, too?
@jgprofilefollowNew herereplied to@evnmprofilefollowSoftware engineerGitHubevnm - Overviewevnm has 51 repositories available. Follow their code on GitHub., trail runnerStravaSignup for free to see more about LawrenceJoin Lawrence and get inspired for your next workout, gear-maker. Working on something new for homeownersgetonmain.comMain ยท A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.:
That's definitely the common knowledge but I'm starting to think that victory -> writing about it has it backwards in a lot of cases, esp in modern corporate life.
@crustyrustaceanprofilefollowOld school metallian, hobbyist developer writing things mostly in Rustโฆmostlywrote:
Hell must have frozen over.
I just installed Openclaw on my Linux box.
I had already cobbled together an agent like thing (pi) that I talked to over Telegram, so I figured, let's give Openclaw 2.0 a try, locked down completely at first, but slowly opened up over time.
@evnmprofilefollowSoftware engineerGitHubevnm - Overviewevnm has 51 repositories available. Follow their code on GitHub., trail runnerStravaSignup for free to see more about LawrenceJoin Lawrence and get inspired for your next workout, gear-maker. Working on something new for homeownersgetonmain.comMain ยท A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.wrote:
I can't believe Apple fell for foldables
โฆ
@maxinedotdev๐งprofilefolloweat, get a new hobby, sleep, repeat
maxine.devreplied to@evnmprofilefollowSoftware engineerGitHubevnm - Overviewevnm has 51 repositories available. Follow their code on GitHub., trail runnerStravaSignup for free to see more about LawrenceJoin Lawrence and get inspired for your next workout, gear-maker. Working on something new for homeownersgetonmain.comMain ยท A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.:
and an top of that, not calling it the iFold
@jamesjan3profilefollowresearcher, developer, dancerreplied to@evnmprofilefollowSoftware engineerGitHubevnm - Overviewevnm has 51 repositories available. Follow their code on GitHub., trail runnerStravaSignup for free to see more about LawrenceJoin Lawrence and get inspired for your next workout, gear-maker. Working on something new for homeownersgetonmain.comMain ยท A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.:
i think theyre pretty cool. the tech market is too safe nowadays.
@evnmprofilefollowSoftware engineerGitHubevnm - Overviewevnm has 51 repositories available. Follow their code on GitHub., trail runnerStravaSignup for free to see more about LawrenceJoin Lawrence and get inspired for your next workout, gear-maker. Working on something new for homeownersgetonmain.comMain ยท A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.replied to@jamesjan3profilefollowresearcher, developer, dancer:
Totally, I'm glad they're at least trying something new (for Apple).
It just underscores the general failure of imagination vibes I get from everything in tech nowadays. Most of the industry is breathlessly chasing a 20th century "golden age of scifi" vision of AI. And Apple's over there diligently trying to improve upon other companies' products from five years ago.
At least no one's talking about the metaverse anymore.
@jamesjan3profilefollowresearcher, developer, dancerreplied to@evnmprofilefollowSoftware engineerGitHubevnm - Overviewevnm has 51 repositories available. Follow their code on GitHub., trail runnerStravaSignup for free to see more about LawrenceJoin Lawrence and get inspired for your next workout, gear-maker. Working on something new for homeownersgetonmain.comMain ยท A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.:
yea its kind of sad how the design language has all converged to the same phones and laptops. 1990s/2000s tech had so much swag and fun with design, especially japanese brands. i like what nothing does, the uk smartphone brand. at least they have some identity.
and yea the metaverse to my mind was just a meme eversince they introduced it, like I know exactly 0 ppl that own a vr headset, and im with the nerds here. just shows zuck is surrounded by yes men
@evnmprofilefollowSoftware engineerGitHubevnm - Overviewevnm has 51 repositories available. Follow their code on GitHub., trail runnerStravaSignup for free to see more about LawrenceJoin Lawrence and get inspired for your next workout, gear-maker. Working on something new for homeownersgetonmain.comMain ยท A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.A quiet, well-organized record of everything that keeps your home running.replied to@jamesjan3profilefollowresearcher, developer, dancer:
๐ฏ
The more I use Terraform the more I don't like it. Can I just get the option to track state with Ansible?
Say more. I've been using it this year "at scale" and it sucks in the way that everything sucks when the whole company starts using it for everything. I haven't used Ansible in over a decade, but am curious what you like about it better.