Any conversation

I know many small business owners, and a clear majority do have investors, whether spouse, parents, or a small business loan. Easily more than 50% never make a profit. I know a woman who ran a clothing retail store for over a decade, who was never able to pay herself a dime. When the pandemic hit, everyone closed, but the ones who actually needed the business to pay their bills opened up as soon as it was allowed or shortly thereafter. Many took years. They are cosplaying.